Death records are limited at this time and I’ve not been able to confirm any date for Thomas McMurtrie’s demise, though it appears he and Marion had at least four children between 1786 and 1792. I have not yet found a first marriage for John Irvine. Part of the problem is the fact that there were so many people named John Irvine in the Kilmarnock area. One Irvine family looks as though there ought to be a connection with Marion Irvine (and her father John) based on the following evidence. • Marion Irvine was about thirty when she married Alexander Bruce, a shoemaker, in Back St, Kilmarnock in 1834. The family were still living in Back St in 1841. • According the 1841 Census, living in Back St was a family of hand loom weavers consisting of : John Irvin (aged about 60, so born approx 1781 in Ireland) John Irvin also appears in the Rolls of Male Heads of Families survey by the Church of Scotland. In 1834 he was living in Back St. Matthew Irvin (aged about 20, so born approx 1821 in Ayrshire) Joseph Irvin (aged about 18, so born approx 1823 in Ayrshire) The ages suggest that John is more likely to be the grandfather rather than the father of Mathew and Joseph. I contend that their father was another John Irvine who was living in 1841 in Dean Street, Kilmarnock, with his wife Isabella and four children. Dean Street is just 'round the corner' from Back St. This John Irvine (b 1797) could be the brother of Marion Irvine, the daughter of John Irvine and Marion Lamont, who married Alexander Bruce. Interesting background information about Back St can be found in the locations section of this website. Records of the births of Joseph and Matthew have not been found so far and finding Matthew Irvin or John Irvin in later records has not been successful. However, Joseph Irvin’s family history has been fully documented. He was a piano playing singing tutor; a tea-total horticulturalist and stalwart of the community of Auchinleck where he was the railway station master for many years. [link to be created if connection proved] Joseph Irvin married Jane Thomson in Back St, Kilmarnock, in 1843 but shortly afterwards he moved to Fenwick and then to Auchinleck, following a career on the railways. They had at least nine children and some of the middle names seem significant. Janet Crawfurd Irvin b 10 Mar 1843 Jane Hendrie Irvine b 19 Dec 1845 John Irvin b 11 Jun 1848 Joseph Irvin b 15 May 1850 George Irvin b 8 Apr 1852 Marion Lamont Irvin b 15 Apr 1854 Helen Thomson Irvin b 1 Apr 1857 Mary Irvin b 1859 Hugh Irvin b 30 Apr 1861 The tradition of using the surnames of grand-parents as middle names for children was widespread in Scotland as well as naming children after grandparents and parents in a particular way. The use of Henry/Hendry/Hendrie and Thomson are therefore explicable. If the maiden name of Joseph’s mother was Lamont then this could have been Marion Lamont who was the mother of Marion Irvine (b 1803) and could have been Joseph Irvin’s grandmother. But what about Crawfurd and Hendrie? A theory is discussed on the following pages. Joseph Irvin outlived his wife Jeanie Thomson by eight years and he died (aged 80) of acute pneumonia in 1903. The witness on the death record was his son-in-law Robert Wallace who, unfortunately, could not supply any details of Joseph’s parents.